92 VX h/b -stalls while driving-HAS dash lights

wehrd1

New Member
History:
302K miles 5spd VX trim 1992 civic hatchback - NO CEL codes showing

May 2013:
kind of hesitated, sputtered, and then died while driving, (engine warm had been on road about 40 miles at interstate speeds, then parked it long enough for a dental appt) When I left the dentist, i drove about 5 miles, and it died, and I coasted to the side of the road. i had dash lights when it died, so i don't think its the ignition switch/wiring. not weather/heat related, (very mild temps when it occurred, both times) i had the main relay done a couple years ago due to heat no start issue. After stalling, it would crank but not turn over. Had it towed to mech, he couldn't get it to start either...it was several hours from initial stall, to tow to his shop. He couldn't get it to start either...he guessed weak spark. he happened to have another civic in his shop with known good dizzy, so he swapped for testing and that fixed my car, so he replaced my dizzy at that time..(reman, lifetime warranty)

and it happened again 20 days ago. same issue. driving, stalled, had all dash lights upon stall, cranked, wouldn't turn over. This time, i had just started it in parking lot from work and only driven about 3 miles. had it towed to mech, thankfully i have roadside assistance, & was only 4 miles from his shop this time. This time he was really busy, and the car sat for 2 days. When he tried to start it, it started fine.

He replaced the dizzy under warranty, as he couldn't nail down when/or why it would or wouldn't start on any given day... and we drove out of mech just fine...for about 8 miles, then sputtered, stalled & died. We replaced the fuel filter on the side of the road, and the car ran GREAT for 500 miles, then did it AGAiN....sputtered, loss of power, then eventually died. This time I decided to wait about 10 minutes then start it again and drive another 1/4 mile, then would sputter and eventually die again - i limped it as far as i could get closer to home. ended up replacing fuel filter on the side of road AGAIN, and ran like a dream the 15 miles home. Parked it for 1 day, and you guessed it, no start.

Two days ago:
tried to start - started fine - replaced main relay anyway - started fine still. Sat 2 days - tried to start in on Saturday - no go - cranked strong, wouldn't catch

This morning (Sunday):
Started FINE!

What else do we check? This is my daily commuter, and I drive 100 r/t. I can't have this bucking and stalling continually happening, or the no start issue. Is there a main computer/controller somewhere??

Help??

Thanks guys!
 

RonJ

Banned
STOP REPLACING PARTS AT RANDOM. Stopping f***ing around. The next time the engine won't start check for spark and listen for whether the fuel pump primes.

I suspect that you'll find that the engine lacks spark and that the mechanic installed a cheap eBay distributor. But don't guess. Do the necessary troubleshooting I mentioned.
 


wehrd1

New Member
I had the relay on hand, as I have 3 civics. so i'm not throwing parts at it.

i think the fuel pump may be dead - we disconnected the lines to the fuel filter, and turned the key on - i heard the relay click 2ce, never did hear the fuel pump prime, and no fuel came out the lines.

and i don't have diagnostic tools and i have very basic technical knowledge. and i know nothing about electronics. So if the fuel pump is kicked off by something electrical somewhere, i guess i'm screwed, if replacing it doesn't work. I replaced it back in 2008, and i average 25K miles/year, so that was about 125K miles ago.

Thank you anyway. and for those that care enough to help, i'll report back when we get the fuel pump replaced.
 

RonJ

Banned
You received my response at Honda-Tech. The way you are trying to fix your car is Neanderthal at best. DO DIAGNOSTICS OR PAY A GOOD MECHANIC because you're wasting your time and money. Enough said.
 


wehrd1

New Member
The distributor was one from a parts supply store, with lifetime warranty, not off ebay. I'll do the spark tests in your signature later this week.

Thank you
 

RonJ

Banned
wehrd1 said:
The distributor was one from a parts supply store, with lifetime warranty, not off ebay. I'll do the spark tests in your signature later this week.

Thank you
Click to expand...
You've asked for help on a technical forum. Be prepared to learn and to change the way you've been "fixing" car problems.
 

wehrd1

New Member
Thank you for your assistance.

I'll stay on this forum, as the other one is looking wonky online. It's lost it's formatting or something. even after i cleared my cookies for it. It's difficult to read and search

Thank you
 

wehrd1

New Member
checked for spark tonight - all 4 firing white.

main relay is good - clicks twice - no fuel pump prime

What do we check next (and how) before i throw more $ at it for a fuel pump
 

RonJ

Banned
Unplug main relay.

Use a piece of wire or a paper clip to short terminal 5 (Blk/Yel wire) to terminal 7 (Yel/Grn wire) in the connector.

Turn the key to ON(II). Does the fuel pump run?

 

Attachments

RonJ

Banned
And do you have a digital multimeter? If not, buy one. Harbor Freight Tools sells one for about $4.
 

wehrd1

New Member
jumped #5 to #7, turned key to II, the fuel pump sounds like it's priming.

now what to test? i'm going to town to buy a digital multi-meter...will check back upon return
 

RonJ

Banned
Good.

Next test is very similar.

Turn the key OFF.

Unplug main relay.

Use a piece of wire or a paper clip to short terminal 1 (Yel/Wht wire) to terminal 7 (Yel/Grn wire) in the main relay connector.

With key still OFF, does the fuel pump run?
 

Attachments

wehrd1

New Member
When we went to town earlier, just for sh!ts and gr!ns i bought a NEW main relay. I made sure I can return it, if needed. I plugged it in, and it starts fine now. Apparently the 2 relays I had (the one causing the trouble, and the 'spare' one I had on hand) were both bad?

I will continue to test as you stated above to rule out any other problems before I assume it's fixed, and get stranded again.
 

RonJ

Banned
wehrd1 said:
When we went to town earlier, just for sh!ts and gr!ns i bought a NEW main relay. I made sure I can return it, if needed. I plugged it in, and it starts fine now. Apparently the 2 relays I had (the one causing the trouble, and the 'spare' one I had on hand) were both bad?

I will continue to test as you stated above to rule out any other problems before I assume it's fixed, and get stranded again.
Click to expand...
A bad main relay would definitely cause the type of problem you were having. No need for more tests unless the problem recurs. However, if the problem resurfaces, then post again. There are other possible causes for the problem. Good luck.
 

wehrd1

New Member
RonJ said:
A bad main relay would definitely cause the type of problem you were having. No need for more tests unless the problem recurs. However, if the problem resurfaces, then post again. There are other possible causes for the problem. Good luck.
Click to expand...
damn damn damn!! it just happened again!

again, it's too cold, as the car is now outside...it died about 1 mile away from home, and i limped it home in 3 restarts. So in the daylight, I will do the jump from #1 to #7 with the key off to see if the fuel pump runs....and report back here. it most likely won't be until Saturday, as my hours at work and my commute doesn't get me home until dark.

Are there any other tests I can try besides the one i just mentioned? When i do finally get to it?

Thanks RonJ for all your info
 

RonJ

Banned
The following tests only yield useful information when the engine won't start.

Start by checking whether the fuel pump primes for 2 seconds when the key is turned to ON(II) and that the CEL turns on and then off after 2 seconds.

If the pump primes and the CEL does not remain on steady, then check for bright white spark at all 4 spark plugs.
 

wehrd1

New Member
RonJ said:
The following tests only yield useful information when the engine won't start.

Start by checking whether the fuel pump primes for 2 seconds when the key is turned to ON(II) and that the CEL turns on and then off after 2 seconds.

If the pump primes and the CEL does not remain on steady, then check for bright white spark at all 4 spark plugs.
Click to expand...
does NOT start (again as of this evening)

when i turn the key to II - the relay clicks, CEL light lights, pump does NOT prime, relay clicks again -

WHITE spark on all 4 plugs as tested the other day when it wouldn't start (before i replaced with new relay, and it worked for 4 days just fine, until tonight)

last Sunday I jumped #5 to #7 and the pump primes.so i thought the relay i had (used) was bad

I will jump #1 to #7 with the engine OFF this Saturday, and let you know what happens. It's too dark & cold where it's sitting
 

wehrd1

New Member
RonJ said:
Does the CEL turn off after 2 seconds or does it stay on steady after the key is turned to ON(II)?
Click to expand...
earlier tonight, when i finally got it limped home. i tried to start it one last time before leaving it where i left it in the front yard, and it wouldn't start. I know the relay clicked, the pump did NOT prime, and the relay clicked again. I canNOT swear to the lighting or length of the lighting of the CEL

This is soooo frustrating. I went out just now, to determine the answer to the above about the CEL...and damn !

the relay clicked, the CEL lit steady for 2 seconds & turned off, pump primed, relay clicked again - the car STARTED.

So now i have to wait until it WON"T start again, to do the #1 to #7 hotwire test??
 
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