Health Care Reform

[got traction]

Just curious to see people's opinions on Obama's health care reform. TRY TO KEEP IT CIVIL!!

Edit by No Regrets:
I see insults being thrown around, infractions will follow and posts deleted. This is your warning.

 

[LowNotSlow]

There's no reform of the actual health system. We're just adding on to it.

Regular people will still be paying too much for healthcare, they'll just have more people to complain to about it.

 

[oc_civic]

to be honest i have stopped watching that entire circus act... i figure over a year into it.. nothing done, so who cares.. what does the current push for reform actually call for?

 

[got traction]

to be honest i have stopped watching that entire circus act... i figure over a year into it.. nothing done, so who cares.. what does the current push for reform actually call for?

its kinda still up in the air, they are trying to throw in "treats" for certain people to sway the votes. Funny thing i heard on the radio the other day, the money that health care reform will save does not exceed the amount of debt the next bill in line will cause.

I am against it for 1 major reason. I have worked hard to have Tricare, it is a entitlement for my military service. Under the reform, they will place a fee on tricare that is so high you will be better off just buying into a health care plan. DO NOT WANT

 

[bizoneoeh]

to be honest i have stopped watching that entire circus act... i figure over a year into it.. nothing done, so who cares.. what does the current push for reform actually call for?

embarrassing for me to admit because I voted for him.....

 

[RonJ]

Well, the country definitely has a major health care problem, but it's still unclear what the final plan will entail. I too voted for Obama, but his administration is struggling as of late. Obama clearly needs to learn more about political compromise and, when this happens, the Republican party needs to play ball. When this all comes together, I hope we have a better system that is accessible to the majority of Americans.

 

[Mr. Jollypants]

Obama clearly needs to learn more about political compromise and, when this happens, the Republican party needs to play ball.

To be honest, there is no political compromise. No matter what Obama does the Republicans will always be against it because he's a democrat. No matter what the republicans do the Democrats will be against it because it's from Republicans. Obama has been too nice so far, it's really time he puts his foot down and starts taking charge with the democrats and republicans.

What about the bill that 7 republicans CO-SPONSORED, then when it came up for vote, all but 2 voted against it.

I really wish something would happen that would really put politicians on the spot and make them stop worrying about their parties politics and start worrying about the peoples problems and fixing them.

About Health Care:
It REALLY needs a reform, not a government paid oe for everyone, but companies, doctors, hospitals, ect. need to be reformed. I was watching a show where a doctor went through a couple of tools they use in surgery and the cost. One stapler cost 2000 dollars. TWO THOUSAND DOLLARS. This is why no one can afford health care or to go to the hospital, these companies, hospitals, doctors and pharmacies need to be put in their place about the costs. Doctors don't need a 500,000 dollar a year salary. They should be paid good, but not 500,000. You picked your job to help people, not to be a millionaire.

 

[RonJ]

To be honest, there is no political compromise. Obama has been too nice so far, it's really time he puts his foot down and starts taking charge with the democrats and republicans.

If you don't have all the votes you need, as is currently the case, then there must be some compromise. In addition, the best plan would be a bipartisan one, if the democrats and republicans can just set aside politics to serve the greater good, as you mentioned.

About Health Care:
It REALLY needs a reform, not a government paid oe for everyone, but companies, doctors, hospitals, ect. need to be reformed. I was watching a show where a doctor went through a couple of tools they use in surgery and the cost. One stapler cost 2000 dollars. TWO THOUSAND DOLLARS. This is why no one can afford health care or to go to the hospital, these companies, hospitals, doctors and pharmacies need to be put in their place about the costs. Doctors don't need a 500,000 dollar a year salary. They should be paid good, but not 500,000. You picked your job to help people, not to be a millionaire.

I mostly agree. It's just that the medical industry has not been able to police and reform itself, so our government (or somebody) now needs to step in.

 

[Mr. Jollypants]

If you don't have all the votes you need, as is currently the case, then there must be some compromise. In addition, the best plan would be a bipartisan one, if the democrats and republicans can just set aside politics to serve the greater good, as you mentioned.

He's been trying bipartisan, so has the Republicans, it all comes down to the fact that if someone votes against their party then they are seen as a traitor, which is bullshit. Alot of good bills come up that could help the American people but it doesn't get voted on, or voted against just because it's from one party or the other.

Another thing that gets on my nerves is all the "breaks" they take. Most of these politicians work for what? 4-5 hours a day? 2-3 days a week? They should be working 24 hours a day, 7 days a week, unless they have a religious event to attended, or family emergency. They get paid good money, live a lavish lifestyle, while millions of Americans are out of jobs, losing their houses, ect. They need to start caring about the American people and not their pockets or any stocks they have. Infact, I believe politicians should have no stock in any company, and they should make their bank statements open to the public so we can actually see how much they are making from special interest groups and lobbyists.

There's so much that can be done that would cut the deficits and operating costs of this country. One of the major things is welfare, you get 12 months of welfare, and while you're cashing those welfare checks, you will be assigned to a job training class at a local college. If you stop attending those classes, you don't get your welfare check. Food stamps, if you make enough to have a nice caddy, and a good house, you don't need food stamps, period. Most California politicians get an allowance to cover gas, insurance, and vehicle maintenance on their personal cars while they have a government vehicle. Stop giving politicians these allowances. They should have to pay for all this just like regular people. Stop paying for the illegal immigrants education and hospital bills. That alone would free up BILLIONS of dollars.

Government officials need to be willing to take a pay cut as well, they automatically raise their salaries, but when it comes to raising minimum wage or anything like, it gets stalemated for weeks. They should be paid hourly, and not 100 dollars an hour, 25-30 dollars a hour would be fine. Then you will really see people working.

 

[Bheims]

He's been trying bipartisan, so has the Republicans, it all comes down to the fact that if someone votes against their party then they are seen as a traitor, which is bullshit. Alot of good bills come up that could help the American people but it doesn't get voted on, or voted against just because it's from one party or the other.

Another thing that gets on my nerves is all the "breaks" they take. Most of these politicians work for what? 4-5 hours a day? 2-3 days a week? They should be working 24 hours a day, 7 days a week, unless they have a religious event to attended, or family emergency. They get paid good money, live a lavish lifestyle, while millions of Americans are out of jobs, losing their houses, ect. They need to start caring about the American people and not their pockets or any stocks they have. Infact, I believe politicians should have no stock in any company, and they should make their bank statements open to the public so we can actually see how much they are making from special interest groups and lobbyists.

There's so much that can be done that would cut the deficits and operating costs of this country. One of the major things is welfare, you get 12 months of welfare, and while you're cashing those welfare checks, you will be assigned to a job training class at a local college. If you stop attending those classes, you don't get your welfare check. Food stamps, if you make enough to have a nice caddy, and a good house, you don't need food stamps, period. Most California politicians get an allowance to cover gas, insurance, and vehicle maintenance on their personal cars while they have a government vehicle. Stop giving politicians these allowances. They should have to pay for all this just like regular people. Stop paying for the illegal immigrants education and hospital bills. That alone would free up BILLIONS of dollars.

Government officials need to be willing to take a pay cut as well, they automatically raise their salaries, but when it comes to raising minimum wage or anything like, it gets stalemated for weeks. They should be paid hourly, and not 100 dollars an hour, 25-30 dollars a hour would be fine. Then you will really see people working.

very good points, obama claims that he is working on limiting the influence of lobbyists in dc but who knows. I highly doubt this will be the last deadline for the healthcare bill anyway, its been pushed back 3 times. Obama is more of a pacifier than an instigator anyway

 

[got traction]

Another issue i have is that Obama smashes on big companies that over spend. He claims that government needed a change because they were wasting money on useless stuff. But, look at Michelle Obama's staff, 22 people? and the price for them is sad..

1. $172,2000 - Sher, Susan (Chief Of Staff)

2. $140,000 - Frye, Jocelyn C. (Deputy Assistant to the President and Director of Policy And Projects For The First Lady)

3. $113,000 - Rogers, Desiree G. (Special Assistant to the President and White House Social Secretary)

4. $102,000 - Johnston, Camille Y. (Special Assistant to the President and Director of Communications for the First Lady)

5. Winter, Melissa E. (Special Assistant to the President and Deputy Chief Of Staff to the First Lady)

6. $90,000 - Medina, David S. (Deputy Chief Of Staff to the First Lady)

7. $84,000 - Lelyveld, Catherine M. (Director and Press Secretary to the First Lady)

8. $75,000 - Starkey, Frances M. (Director of Scheduling and Advance for the First Lady)

9. $70,000 - Sanders, Trooper (Deputy Director of Policy and Projects for the First Lady)

10. $65,000 - Burnough, Erinn J. (Deputy Director and Deputy Social Secretary)

11. Reinstein, Joseph B. (Deputy Director and Deputy Social Secretary)

12. $62,000 - Goodman, Jennifer R. (Deputy Director of Scheduling and Events Coordinator For The First Lady)

13. $60,000 - Fitts, Alan O. (Deputy Director of Advance and Trip Director for the First Lady)

14. Lewis, Dana M. (Special Assistant and Personal Aide to the First Lady)

15. $52,500 - Mustaphi, Semonti M. (Associate Director and Deputy Press Secretary To The First Lady)

16. $50,000 - Jarvis, Kristen E. (Special Assistant for Scheduling and Traveling Aide To The First Lady)

17. $45,000 - Lechtenberg, Tyler A. (Associate Director of Correspondence For The First Lady)

18. Tubman, Samantha (Deputy Associate Director, Social Office)

19. $40,000 - Boswell, Joseph J. (Executive Assistant to the Chief Of Staff to the First Lady)

20. $36,000 - Armbruster, Sally M. (Staff Assistant to the Social Secretary)

21. Bookey, Natalie (Staff Assistant)

22. Jackson, Deilia A. (Deputy Associate Director of Correspondence for the First Lady)

 

[Mr. Jollypants]

It get's pushed back because one party doesn't like what the other party added, ect.

I would like to run for county official, but I know that I won't make it because the other politicians will just force me out because I'm the one who'se actually for the people and trying to save peoples jobs and money. I'm too much of the normal American, I don't have millions of dollars in the bank, I wasn't born into it.

 

[Voltio]

Deputy aka friend of a friend

 

[Voltio]

It get's pushed back because one party doesn't like what the other party added, ect.

I would like to run for county official, but I know that I won't make it because the other politicians will just force me out because I'm the one who'se actually for the people and trying to save peoples jobs and money. I'm too much of the normal American, I don't have millions of dollars in the bank, I wasn't born into it.

And once they find out about all those gay sex tapes....

 

[Mr. Jollypants]

Another issue i have is that Obama smashes on big companies that over spend. He claims that government needed a change because they were wasting money on useless stuff. But, look at Michelle Obama's staff, 22 people? and the price for them is sad..

1. $172,2000 - Sher, Susan (Chief Of Staff)

2. $140,000 - Frye, Jocelyn C. (Deputy Assistant to the President and Director of Policy And Projects For The First Lady)

3. $113,000 - Rogers, Desiree G. (Special Assistant to the President and White House Social Secretary)

4. $102,000 - Johnston, Camille Y. (Special Assistant to the President and Director of Communications for the First Lady)

5. Winter, Melissa E. (Special Assistant to the President and Deputy Chief Of Staff to the First Lady)

6. $90,000 - Medina, David S. (Deputy Chief Of Staff to the First Lady)

7. $84,000 - Lelyveld, Catherine M. (Director and Press Secretary to the First Lady)

8. $75,000 - Starkey, Frances M. (Director of Scheduling and Advance for the First Lady)

9. $70,000 - Sanders, Trooper (Deputy Director of Policy and Projects for the First Lady)

10. $65,000 - Burnough, Erinn J. (Deputy Director and Deputy Social Secretary)

11. Reinstein, Joseph B. (Deputy Director and Deputy Social Secretary)

12. $62,000 - Goodman, Jennifer R. (Deputy Director of Scheduling and Events Coordinator For The First Lady)

13. $60,000 - Fitts, Alan O. (Deputy Director of Advance and Trip Director for the First Lady)

14. Lewis, Dana M. (Special Assistant and Personal Aide to the First Lady)

15. $52,500 - Mustaphi, Semonti M. (Associate Director and Deputy Press Secretary To The First Lady)

16. $50,000 - Jarvis, Kristen E. (Special Assistant for Scheduling and Traveling Aide To The First Lady)

17. $45,000 - Lechtenberg, Tyler A. (Associate Director of Correspondence For The First Lady)

18. Tubman, Samantha (Deputy Associate Director, Social Office)

19. $40,000 - Boswell, Joseph J. (Executive Assistant to the Chief Of Staff to the First Lady)

20. $36,000 - Armbruster, Sally M. (Staff Assistant to the Social Secretary)

21. Bookey, Natalie (Staff Assistant)

22. Jackson, Deilia A. (Deputy Associate Director of Correspondence for the First Lady)

I completely agree, that could be cut down to 5-6 people, with a 60,000 salary.

 

[Mr. Jollypants]

And once they find out about all those gay sex tapes....

 

[RonJ]

3. $113,000 - Rogers, Desiree G. (Special Assistant to the President and White House Social Secretary)

Haha...this one recently resigned for the infamous party crashing incident at the White House.

 

[got traction]

my question is why cant a bill about healthcare just be about healthcare? why does there have to be other things in that bill that have absolutly nothing to do with the subject?

 

[Mr. Jollypants]

Because everyone is out to please their party, that's the main deal breaker.

 

[oc_civic]

T
About Health Care:
It REALLY needs a reform, not a government paid oe for everyone, but companies, doctors, hospitals, ect. need to be reformed. I was watching a show where a doctor went through a couple of tools they use in surgery and the cost. One stapler cost 2000 dollars. TWO THOUSAND DOLLARS. This is why no one can afford health care or to go to the hospital, these companies, hospitals, doctors and pharmacies need to be put in their place about the costs. Doctors don't need a 500,000 dollar a year salary. They should be paid good, but not 500,000. You picked your job to help people, not to be a millionaire.

this may be the ONLY time we ever agree in one of these threads.. but i agree FULLY...

history..

health care becomes higher and higher demand as population increases...
schools increase by a s**t ton amount in charging people to learn to be in the medical field...
people pay a ton to learn...
they go into practice and thus charge a ton to perform..
companies who provide materials for them to perform SEE the profit the medical industry makes so THEY in turn charge a ton for equipment ($2k staplers)
pharmaceutical companies jump on board..

costs skyrocket at a disproportionate rate to the increase in earnings others are seeing while performing other jobs..

meaning i have been at the same job for ten years.. i NOW make 4x what i made in the beginning but health costs have rose 200x.. so how the f**k am i supposed to cover the difference..

**this is where out opinion on the solution may differ**
i dont KNOW what the answer is.. but i can say that i DONT feel government handouts are the answer.. i feel the BEST solution to ANY problem is the LEAST amount of government interference... maybe it is time to look at businesses like the health care industry as a whole, as they DO on some level monopolize the market.. its not really like a TV that you can shop around for.. MAYBE having common sense limits on increases in cost over time would be reasonable..

BUT the problem is FAR greater than JUST health care.. the problem is we are a country of gross waste.... and assbackwards thinking...

from the economy, immigration, gun control, health care.. EVERYTHING is ridiculously screwed up..

it all starts with the thought of entitlement.. people THINK that the government should care for them (welfare, housing assistance, etc.. )... people think that by merely being born within the confines of these borders (or immigrating to) that equates a free lunch... and the government REINFORCES that... I was standing behind a women in line at the grocery store the other day and she had SEVERAL gallons of milk.. and she was talking to her friend.. and her friend said something like "whach you need all that milk for" and the lady responded something like "if i dont use up all the credit im given (she had that food stamp credit card thing) they might not give me as much later... its cool i just give the milk to my friend next door"... so this a*****e is buying milk with MY tax dollars.. and redistributing it as she sees fit.. and WHY is she doing this? because she is SO greedy that she wants to be SURE she gets the MOST she can even if its WELL more than she needs..

there are two problems
1) TOO much free **** for people who do NOTHING
2) not enough work for people who WANT to work

these two problems could be solved pretty quickly but it would take a HUGE nationwide turn around.. we could increase jobs by removing the illegal immigrant element.. this would free up jobs for those currently "collecting".. once there is a surplus of jobs you remove the easily obtainable welfare.. people say "oh people dont want to work the jobs illegals do" and that is true.. why because they have been conditioned to think that they are above that..

yank someones welfare..
let them sit for a couple weeks..
and that job doing crap work at the local farm will look FAR more appealing as hunger sits in..

the other issue is our ridiculous legal system.. we OVER COMPLICATE everything..
law could be simplified down to some VERY basic principals... the reevaluation and removal of laws that have no practical benefit would reduce the demand of national security (dea, police, etc..) these forces could then be used to actually address the task of removing people who should not be here..

Could go on for days.. but if you start SIMPLE

Shut down illegals from coming in..
*reduces demand on LE
*reduces resource waste caring for people who do NOT belong here
*reduces money being earned in this nation (tax free) and sent abroad (thus increasing money spent here)
*reduces criminal activity created by people who are virtually untraceable
*creates more jobs

This creation of more jobs would then be transferred to actual citizens which would then create less of a need for government handouts

This would create less of a need for taxation, thus increasing the money that stays in YOUR pocket...

All of this would then make it more reasonable to buy things like health insurance..