Proper Method for Setting TDC on 98 EX

[JSpiers]

Issues with 1998 Honda Civic EX DY6Y8 idling rough or not wanting to run at all. See this thread for the the things I've done in my troubleshooting efforts. Only progress I've made is by removing distributor housing bolts, advancing timing outside of the range of the housing slots. If I hold the distributor in this place, car starts and runs fine.

I checked the mechanical timing according to my Haynes manual (align cam shaft pulley lines with top of head and white dot on crank gear lined up with pointer on timing belt cover) and it checks out. Found the picture posted below that shows the cam gear lines are supposed to match up with the arrows on the lower timing belt cover for my car (offset from head). What is the proper method for starting over and setting up TDC? I can't think of anything else that might cause what I'm experiencing.


https://picasaweb.google.com/106297735523493305327/DropBox?authuser=0&feat=directlink

 

[RonJ]

Your engine probably doesn't have those arrows. Align the cam pulley marks with the top line of the head (see diagram below), as it sounds like you've already done.

Did you use a timing gun to set the ignition timing to spec?

Any CEL codes?

When were your spark plugs, wires, cap, and rotor last replaced?

 

[JSpiers]

Ron, I pulled the upper timing belt cover and discovered the arrows on the upper portion of the lower timing belt cover.

I have replaced all of these components: distributor, plugs, 02 sensor, and ohmed the wires.

With the crankshaft at TDC, the camshaft pulley marks line up with the face of the head exactly. If I were to try and adjust the camshaft with the marks on the lower timing belt cover, I would have to move the camshaft one tooth. According to my measurements, this would put me slightly below the mark at the 9 oclock position, and slightly above the mark at the 3 oclock position on the lower timing belt cover. Would this help my situation with the car not running after setting the time with a timing light?

In its existing setup (marks lined up with head), the car will only run with the timing significantly advanced. In order to do this, had to remove distributor bolts and adjust distributor outside of the housing slots. However, the car is very repeatable with this timing. It will crank every time and runs very smooth. No CEL codes with timing advanced.

 

[RonJ]

Your mechanical timing is off by one tooth.

Do you have a stock D16Y8 engine?

Can you post clear pictures of the cam and crank positioned at TDC1? Remember to ONLY rotate the crank pulley counterclockwise until the cam is set perfectly at TDC1. (Arrow up -- the marks on the rear of the cam pulley are most accurate for aligning with the top surface of the head.) Then look to see whether the pointer aligns with the lone white mark on the crank pulley.

 

[JSpiers]

Yes it is a stock DY618 engine.

How do I rotate the cam pulley without loosening the cam bolt that holds it onto the keyed shaft? Looks like I went to far when I was rotating it (with timing belt off), tried to continue moving the cam pulley 360 degrees and leave at TDC but the bolt loosened. Was thinking of using a strap wrench on the pulley to rotate? Is there any interference with the pistons if I'm not moving the crank simultaneously with the timing belt? Dont want to damage anything.

 

[RonJ]

Yes, it's and interference engine.

I'm not sure what you're asking or trying to do.

Pictures are always helpful.

 

[JSpiers]

Trying to get cam shaft pulley marks line up with head and have crank shaft pulley at TDC (white mark lined up with pointer).

I rotated the cam shaft pulley too far when trying to get the marks lined up with the head (timing belt disconnected from crank shaft pulley)

Now the crank shaft pulley is at TDC (white mark lined up with pointer), but the cam shaft pulley has been advanced too many teeth too far counter clockwise. How do I get the cam shaft pulley and crank shaft pulley back in sync at TDC?

 

[JSpiers]

Update - Just wanted to let everyone know what I finally found and fixed.
I found an intermittent spark plug wire, that was causing all of my rough idle issues. Even though I ohmed out each wire, and they were will within the tolerance described in my service manual, at least one was defective. I had previously replaced them in the past 5 years. After putting a new set it, the car runs perfect.

 

[Trekk]

Cool, 2 other things you could of done was, spray some water over the wires and look for the jumps (easy at night) or take a screw driver (or test light) ground the screw driver with a wire, and hover over the wires with it, the spark will jump out and hit the screwdriver.