Letter to the President

[Mr. Jollypants]

I think that I already agree with most of what you are saying anyway....

It's not what I'm saying mostly, it's talking about how other healthcare around the world is different from ours, and busts myths that most Americans believe.

 

[Hecz]

Oh yeah, their fault they can't get a second job, man if only those people could just snap their fingers and make the economy turn around

so in other words, it's the economy's fault... gotcha!

Thanks for the replies.
Have a good weekend.

 

[Mr. Jollypants]

so in other words, it's the economy's fault... gotcha!

Thanks for the replies.
Have a good weekend.

You would be a good politician, you really twist words around to make them how you want.

It's like OC said, it's a lot of people fault we are in the recession we are in. With this recession there are not a lot jobs like there was when the economy was doing great.

 

[joe7987]

yes I still think that doctors make too much money..
the reason I think that is simple.. normal tax paying working class individuals who have small families living modest lives have a hard time affording health care.. but as I already explained the problem extends past health care.. look at the legal system for example.. granted non of this is really the concern of the government... but you are not valuing normal average working class individuals enough.. without one sprocket.. without one gear.. the machine may still run.. but have you ever seen an inner city community when the sanitation workers go on strike? in a very short period of time garbage piles up.. rodents become rampant.. you simply can not have a working society without EVERY aspect of it..

The reason Doctors get payed more than these individuals is this. If a sanitation worker quits, he is easily replaceable (unless he's an upper level engineer of course. In which case, he's making decent pay anyway.) If a neurosurgeon quits... especially a good one... good luck. Have you checked the wanted adds lately? Did you notice the insane amount of demand for resident nurses?

It's the same thing with low quantity products. When a particular technology cannot be produced quickly enough to meet the demand for said product, the company can charge more. They have a product with exclusivity. It can't just be found anywhere.

Many workers in the medical industry hold the same exclusivity. For that reason, it costs more to make use of that product.. in this case, the product is a doctor.

Basic economics really explains it all. It's the way our society works. In this regard, the medical field does not operate any differently than the rest of America.

 

[oc_civic]

The reason Doctors get payed more than these individuals is this. If a sanitation worker quits, he is easily replaceable (unless he's an upper level engineer of course. In which case, he's making decent pay anyway.) If a neurosurgeon quits... especially a good one... good luck. Have you checked the wanted adds lately? Did you notice the insane amount of demand for resident nurses?

It's the same thing with low quantity products. When a particular technology cannot be produced quickly enough to meet the demand for said product, the company can charge more. They have a product with exclusivity. It can't just be found anywhere.

Many workers in the medical industry hold the same exclusivity. For that reason, it costs more to make use of that product.. in this case, the product is a doctor.

Basic economics really explains it all. It's the way our society works. In this regard, the medical field does not operate any differently than the rest of America.

we agree completely on the last part.. this is why I am COMPLETELY anti government run health care..

but they are losing site of the big picture.. our society economically is not what it used to be.. businesses are cutting benefit packages to save money.. and average workers who can not afford insurance don't have it..

so the field is growing exponentially and being filled by health care professionals...

but the number of people who are going to be able to afford the care those individuals provide are dwindling....

 

[Aaron.]

word....

 

[vjf915]

Average Medical School Loan Debt - Under 100,000. That's 400 dollars a month, for 20 years. Yeah, really high tuition

I dont know where you get your numbers, but they are off. First of all you say 400 a month for 20 years, thats 96k. No financial agency is going to let you pay off 100k over 20 years with no interest. Second, my brother went to Pharmaceutical school for 6 years, and had $200k in debt when he got out. So for a doctor to go to school for 8+ years and only have $100k, I highly doubt it.

On top of this, I think a lot of people are missing one fundamental fact. We live in a Capitalistic society. That means that demand=dollars. If there is a HIGH demand for something, they are going to charge a high rate for it. There is not as much of a high rate for plumbing or electrical work because someone with a little bit of common sense, and access to the internet can do simple tasks at home. You CANNOT do that when you break an arm or get cancer. You guys complain that the government doesnt come in and regulate hospitals, but then you DO complain that they come in and regulate other things. Well which is it, do you want Socialism or Capitalism? Pick.

 

[Mr. Jollypants]

I dont know where you get your numbers, but they are off. First of all you say 400 a month for 20 years, thats 96k. No financial agency is going to let you pay off 100k over 20 years with no interest. Second, my brother went to Pharmaceutical school for 6 years, and had $200k in debt when he got out. So for a doctor to go to school for 8+ years and only have $100k, I highly doubt it.

http://www.ama-assn.org/ama/pub/about-ama/our-people/member-groups-sections/medical-student-section/advocacy-policy/medical-student-debt.shtml

American Medical Association: Average Loan Debt for Medical Students 156,456. Over 20 years thats 651.90 a month.

On top of this, I think a lot of people are missing one fundamental fact. We live in a Capitalistic society. That means that demand=dollars. If there is a HIGH demand for something, they are going to charge a high rate for it.

That's for normal countries, our country has a tendency to overcharge for things that are already overcharged.

You guys complain that the government doesnt come in and regulate hospitals, but then you DO complain that they come in and regulate other things. Well which is it, do you want Socialism or Capitalism? Pick.

I don't complain when they come in and regulate hospitals. I wish they would, they need to be regulated and FOR-Profit hospitals need to go away, they are the cancer that has caused this influx in price along with insurance and other factors.

Socialism has some great benefits as well, not that it's great as a whole, but it does have it's benefits.

 

[vjf915]

Dont get me wrong Jason, I agree with you on A LOT of points you have made. I think we need national healthcare....to make it even simpler.....lets just have government funded hospitals. You walk in, they determine you are a legal citizen, you get your service, and go on your way. Im all for it. Im just stating that people complain about government regulated this, then complain when they DONT regulate other things. Its inconsistent.

 

[Mr. Jollypants]

Dont get me wrong Jason, I agree with you on A LOT of points you have made. I think we need national healthcare....to make it even simpler.....lets just have government funded hospitals. You walk in, they determine you are a legal citizen, you get your service, and go on your way. Im all for it. Im just stating that people complain about government regulated this, then complain when they DONT regulate other things. Its inconsistent.

There are certain things I don't think the government should regulate, and some they should regulate more.

 

[vjf915]

Right, but the only problem is......other people want different things regulated than what YOU want regulated.

 

[Mr. Jollypants]

Right, but the only problem is......other people want different things regulated than what YOU want regulated.

Their opinion is stupid

 

[vjf915]

Thank you for making me laugh on this terrible, terrible night

 

[joe7987]

 

[JiuJitsu_greg]

I dont think that the government should GIVE anything.. they are there to govern.. NOT to serve the role of a financial lender.. remove all the bloated BS from gov spending and taxes should drop through the floor..

Exactly, but if they are going to take then they had better attempt to help people with the money that they get from us citizens.

 

[Mr. Jollypants]

Their opinion is stupid

I should probably point out, that as a staff member, this was meant as a joke, I don't want members getting butthurt

 

[vjf915]

Thank you, because I was about to PM one of the mods about you

 

[Kswest]

I should probably point out, that as a staff member, this was meant as a joke, I don't want members getting butthurt

Damn, I wanted a free excuse to report you.

 

[Mr. Jollypants]

Thank you, because I was about to PM one of the mods about you

You wouldn't!

Damn, I wanted a free excuse to report you.

Do it!

 

[got traction]

Show me how I said that I should get to decide what people make? All I stated was that there are people who get paid quite a bit for what they do and what they provide to society. There were many others who made comments much closer to what you are describing, so Im pretty confused as to why you are coming at me like that.

see below...

There are MANY people who make wayyyyyyy to much money for what they do, and do less work than someone who supports 4 kids on $30k a year. Its the nature of the beast that we all know as "Capitalism." You cant beat it or get around it.

with all due respect.. health care for a small family would be pretty tight, right now it is just me and my g/f and we make enough to get by and do the things we want to do, and sure if we eliminated the stuff in our lives that are non-essential we could likely buy our own health insurance.. but the reality is the medical industry IS gouging the s**t out of the American public.. YES we have great medicine.. YES we have great hospitals.. and so on.. but the level of cost for even basic care at a hospital is pretty out of control... and without any "help" medical insurance for a family living on a modest income IS pretty tight... I get your point but its not like everyone is living like that..

I pay roughly 250 a month in healthcare for my wife/kid. Its 80/20 care, meaning they cover 80%, and i pay 20% plus a 35 dollar co-pay. With that said, i think its pretty irresponsible of you to decide not to have health insurance so you can have some pocket money. By you not having health insurance for yourself and GF, who would pay if something were to happen to you and you were hospitalized? (god forbid). Its not fair to me, as a tax payer, to pick up your tab because you would rather spend money on fun things, rather than pay for health insurance.

In no way am i attacking your character, so dont take it that way....just trying to throw my input out there