blknpurple
New Member
So some pics of the car...unfortunately, it looks better in grayscale lol
Wow I got screwed...
- Thread starter blknpurple
- Start date
Civic Virtue
New Member
It would run nasty throughout the entire powerband, so maybe the timing belt is fine. Do single cams even jump teeth like DOHCs? Never thought about it haha.
Chrisfrom1986
New Member
Man you need some serious help here. First of all, fix your distributor. Looks like you have a z6 head, so you need a z6 distributor and a jumper harness. Second of all, there is a plug inside the block that you need to remove for vtec to work properly for a mini me swap. If it isnt removed, vtec will not engage. It looks like you have an automatic d16y8 intake manifold so you wont have a FITV. The large capped vacuum port is part of your missing evap system. Heres a couple diagrams that should help you straighten everything out with your coolant lines and vacuum lines.
Butterz
New Member
Hi,
I have a '00 EK with a '95 D16A (which is pretty much identical to a Z6) so I might be able to give you some insight to your little engine dilemma. You really aren't as bad off as you think. What you've got on your hands is a situation where the person putting that motor in didn't do enough research before hand.
The head that's on that engine is OBD1, which is the wiring that came in '92 - '92 civics (also known as EGs). The wiring harness in your civic however, is OBD2a. Which means the majority of the plugs for the head and intake manifold won't match up with the plugs for your wiring harness. To fix this, a common quick fix is to attach an OBD2 intake manifold onto an OBD1 head (instead of changing all the plugs in the wiring harness), which is what this person did, and that's okay because it works fine.
However, the distributor for a VTEC head is different from the one on a Non-VTEC head; the 3 brackets that hold it on are angled differently to avoid getting them mixed up. The plug for the OBD1 distributor that would've went with the head that's on that engine is also different from the original OBD2a distributor plug, so the person that did the swap must have assumed VTEC and non-VTEC distributors were the same and just made it fit on the head using that stupid bracket.
Here's an example of a VTEC distributor vs a Non-VTEC distributor
Here's what you need to do to solve your problem
Option A
Get yourself a distributor off of a D16Y8 (found in a Civic EX) from a '96 - '98. It should bolt right to that head because it's from a VTEC engine, and it should have the correct plugs to match the distributor plug on your wiring harness (provided it's a Y8 wiring harness).
Option B - RECOMMENDED
Buy a Z6 distributor and a Y8 distributor. Take the guts out of the Y8 distributor and put them inside the Z6 distributor housing. This way you'll have the distributor housing that fits correctly, and the wiring that matches up to your wiring harness.
One thing I want to point out is the internals you need for the distributor are going to depend on what wiring harness that person used when they did the swap. If they left the stock Y7 harness in (which I believe they did), Option A isn't going to work because the Y8 distributor plug won't match the Y7 harness. This also means that to do Option B, you'll need a Y7 distributor in place of the Y8 distributor.
I know it's a lot to read but it's worth it. Here's a link on how to rebuild a distributor:
http://www.civic-eg.com/viewtopic.php?p=223990
I have a '00 EK with a '95 D16A (which is pretty much identical to a Z6) so I might be able to give you some insight to your little engine dilemma. You really aren't as bad off as you think. What you've got on your hands is a situation where the person putting that motor in didn't do enough research before hand.
The head that's on that engine is OBD1, which is the wiring that came in '92 - '92 civics (also known as EGs). The wiring harness in your civic however, is OBD2a. Which means the majority of the plugs for the head and intake manifold won't match up with the plugs for your wiring harness. To fix this, a common quick fix is to attach an OBD2 intake manifold onto an OBD1 head (instead of changing all the plugs in the wiring harness), which is what this person did, and that's okay because it works fine.
However, the distributor for a VTEC head is different from the one on a Non-VTEC head; the 3 brackets that hold it on are angled differently to avoid getting them mixed up. The plug for the OBD1 distributor that would've went with the head that's on that engine is also different from the original OBD2a distributor plug, so the person that did the swap must have assumed VTEC and non-VTEC distributors were the same and just made it fit on the head using that stupid bracket.
Here's an example of a VTEC distributor vs a Non-VTEC distributor
Here's what you need to do to solve your problem
Option A
Get yourself a distributor off of a D16Y8 (found in a Civic EX) from a '96 - '98. It should bolt right to that head because it's from a VTEC engine, and it should have the correct plugs to match the distributor plug on your wiring harness (provided it's a Y8 wiring harness).
Option B - RECOMMENDED
Buy a Z6 distributor and a Y8 distributor. Take the guts out of the Y8 distributor and put them inside the Z6 distributor housing. This way you'll have the distributor housing that fits correctly, and the wiring that matches up to your wiring harness.
One thing I want to point out is the internals you need for the distributor are going to depend on what wiring harness that person used when they did the swap. If they left the stock Y7 harness in (which I believe they did), Option A isn't going to work because the Y8 distributor plug won't match the Y7 harness. This also means that to do Option B, you'll need a Y7 distributor in place of the Y8 distributor.
I know it's a lot to read but it's worth it. Here's a link on how to rebuild a distributor:
http://www.civic-eg.com/viewtopic.php?p=223990
Chrisfrom1986
New Member
No it doesnt because its not the same head. You match the distributor to the head your using. ONLY a Z6 distributor will work on a Z6 head. Either repin the plugs to OBD2 to match your engine harness or buy a jumper harness.
blknpurple
New Member
Chris and Butterz, it seems like you guys sign up to the forum just to help me out. I really appreciate it!! Right now I'm getting a P2P OBD2a ECU. Should I get a z6 and y7 dizzy then swap the internals or should I just get a z6 dizzy then repin? I'm gonna have to repin the plugs for the ECU for VTEC and knock sensor anyways, right? OR, since I probably have a y7 dizzy, I can just swap the internals into a z6 dizzy right?
Also, just found a really good link for y7/z6 mini me swap:
http://spdweb.net/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=30&Itemid=41
Also, just found a really good link for y7/z6 mini me swap:
http://spdweb.net/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=30&Itemid=41
Civic Virtue
New Member
That is if I decide to ship it out or not...
Chrisfrom1986
New Member
Thats a great page with the info that will help you. Just pick up a z6 distributor and repin the plug. Maybe without cutting the wires like they did in the guide. That would be the easiest way.
Butterz
New Member
Repinning can be really tough when switching between OBD2 and OBD1 because the wire colours aren't always the exact same. Like I said before, get a Z6 diz and put Y7 internals in it. This is exactly what I just did for my swap and it works like a charm.
What do you mean by the knock sensor? The CKF sensor is one of the only differences from OBD2 to OBD1 engine harnesses, and it's located on the block, which means your Y7 harness should already be wired for it.
So just to be clear:
You are not going to use this:
You'll plug that P2P OBD2a ECU directly into the harness, you'll have to run the two wires for VTEC (ECU pinout found here: http://technet.ff-squad.com/wiring.obd2a.htm). Get a Z6 diz and put Y7 internals in it (guide found here: http://civic-eg.com/viewtopic.php?p=223990).
Let me know how it works out
blknpurple
New Member
Ok, so been busy with school and work. So finally got some time today to mess around with my car. Took off the the distributor cap and looked around, got some buildup crap on each "terminal" so I took some sandpaper to them, they were crusty and "cement" like, some pics:
BTW, the car came with an adjustable cam gear, so hopefully it'll come in handy soon here, still waiting for the ECU and probably gonna pick up that z6 dizzy tomorrow and start swapping the internals
Hey guys, could you tell me if this is too much slack on the TB? it vibrates a lot as the RPM increases, the whole car vibrates like crazy, I'm usually numb after an hour drive.....
BTW, the car came with an adjustable cam gear, so hopefully it'll come in handy soon here, still waiting for the ECU and probably gonna pick up that z6 dizzy tomorrow and start swapping the internals
Hey guys, could you tell me if this is too much slack on the TB? it vibrates a lot as the RPM increases, the whole car vibrates like crazy, I'm usually numb after an hour drive.....
blknpurple
New Member
O yea, so after the clean up of the dizzy cap, car still runs the same. Popping at idle, fine once it starts moving, a lot of vibration....But I did notice a change between gear shifts. Before, when I engage the clutch, the RPM would surge up before I shift into the next gear. Now, the surge is minimal. So I'll probably be getting a new fuel filter tomorrow too. Will keep you guys updated!
Civic Virtue
New Member
ECU Wednesday!
I still think the timing is way off which would cause the back firing and rough vibrations. Have you set the number 1 piston at TDC and checked where the cam gear was at? Pop the plug out, stick a long screwdriver into the cylinder so the piston dome touches the screw driver, and with a wrench slowly turn the crank counter clockwise until the screwdriver is lifted to its highest point. The circle with a slash through it and tick marks should be the #1 cyl TDC mark if the cam gear is installed correctly. This will tell you if the belt jumped a tooth or not.
I still think the timing is way off which would cause the back firing and rough vibrations. Have you set the number 1 piston at TDC and checked where the cam gear was at? Pop the plug out, stick a long screwdriver into the cylinder so the piston dome touches the screw driver, and with a wrench slowly turn the crank counter clockwise until the screwdriver is lifted to its highest point. The circle with a slash through it and tick marks should be the #1 cyl TDC mark if the cam gear is installed correctly. This will tell you if the belt jumped a tooth or not.
blknpurple
New Member
I did mention the idle was surging thus I quoted pics when I was trying to clean the IACV/FITV...Someone mentioned it may have been a timing issue, and I said it runs fine outside of idle....
So finally got the Z6 dizzy, went to the part store and got a fuel filter along with the alternator belt since the one on the car is all cracked. Removed the gas cap before replacing the filter, I took off the filter and there was NO fuel dripping out at all, a little hiss when I loosened the banjo bolt, that's it. Also noticed the new and old filters are slightly different internally:
Hopefully wont be a problem
Took off the wrong izzy, realized it was only held on by one bolt, so had to go to local hardware store and grabbed 3 bolts, also got some lock washers to go along with them:
Here's a pic with the dizzies side by side, also the incorrect dizzy seems to have a lot more play on the end than the z6 dizzy:
Well dinner time, gonna attack the transplant after a full stomach!! More updates tonight!!
blknpurple
New Member
Ok, range report. After transplanting the innards of the dizzies, time to put the z6 dizzy to work. I used all the internals from the franken-dizzy, except for the rotor and coil pack. The Franken-dizzy seemed to have been a reman, the innards look fairly new so I figured I'll be ok either way. Went to put the z6 dizzy on the head and realized the bolts I bought were too long.....of course no hardware store is still open at 830pm, so I stole a bolt from my brother's 98 beater sedan d16y7 dizzy, stack all 3 washers and a lock washer on the bolt that came off the Franken-dizzy. So I got 2 bolts holding the dizzy and so does my brother. Promise I will get the correct size and will return his bolt as soon as I get home from school tomorrow.
Got the dizzy on, tighten down the bolt just enough so I can still rotate the dizzy. Turn the key on to prime the fuel, crank, engine turn over bunch of times, thought it wasnt gonna start, thinking to myself "what did I f**k up on the dizzy transplant??!?!", and vroom, the car started!!! It idles well, no more pop popping!! It does make a weird scraping noise, I think the teeth inside on the shaft are hitting the sensors. It clicked when I turned it by hand, but it's y7 sensors with y7 shaft...should I use y7 sensors with z6 shaft? I dont think it'll make a difference....
Well I'm happy the car idles fine now, a little of valve chatter I didnt hear before, the engine is less noisy and noticeably less vibration. Took it for a test drive, jumped on the freeway, very slight hesitation in 2nd. The car does seem a little less aggressive than before though...Gotta mess with the timing a little I think...At the light, the car idles at around 800rpm, and NO MORE SURGING!!! I was very happy, it almost as quiet as my brother's bone stock y7.
I'm pretty sure it was the dizzy that made the difference and the fuel filter helped too. The weird noise I mentioned when the z6 dizzy was first installed went away too, maybe the teeth and sensors found a sweet spot and not fight each other that much right now. Imma have to keep driving and see.
Next up on project BlacknPurple, or giant f**king lemon, are:
-Get correct length bolts for dizzy
-Verify timing
-Install VTEC ECU, connect wires for VTEC
-realign bumper, fenders, and headlights, they're getting on my nerves
-install type R front lip
-get the right ride height that I like, maybe a little more raked
-connect horn
-clean driver side headlight
-alignment, at a shop, of course
-maybe rear LCAs
Big thank you to everyone, I'll keep updating the thread and I hope to hear everyone's input. Hopefully we'll turn this into a learning experience for everyone, especially from one noob to another...
Got the dizzy on, tighten down the bolt just enough so I can still rotate the dizzy. Turn the key on to prime the fuel, crank, engine turn over bunch of times, thought it wasnt gonna start, thinking to myself "what did I f**k up on the dizzy transplant??!?!", and vroom, the car started!!! It idles well, no more pop popping!! It does make a weird scraping noise, I think the teeth inside on the shaft are hitting the sensors. It clicked when I turned it by hand, but it's y7 sensors with y7 shaft...should I use y7 sensors with z6 shaft? I dont think it'll make a difference....
Well I'm happy the car idles fine now, a little of valve chatter I didnt hear before, the engine is less noisy and noticeably less vibration. Took it for a test drive, jumped on the freeway, very slight hesitation in 2nd. The car does seem a little less aggressive than before though...Gotta mess with the timing a little I think...At the light, the car idles at around 800rpm, and NO MORE SURGING!!! I was very happy, it almost as quiet as my brother's bone stock y7.
I'm pretty sure it was the dizzy that made the difference and the fuel filter helped too. The weird noise I mentioned when the z6 dizzy was first installed went away too, maybe the teeth and sensors found a sweet spot and not fight each other that much right now. Imma have to keep driving and see.
Next up on project BlacknPurple, or giant f**king lemon, are:
-Get correct length bolts for dizzy
-Verify timing
-Install VTEC ECU, connect wires for VTEC
-realign bumper, fenders, and headlights, they're getting on my nerves
-install type R front lip
-get the right ride height that I like, maybe a little more raked
-connect horn
-clean driver side headlight
-alignment, at a shop, of course
-maybe rear LCAs
Big thank you to everyone, I'll keep updating the thread and I hope to hear everyone's input. Hopefully we'll turn this into a learning experience for everyone, especially from one noob to another...
Civic Virtue
New Member
Good to hear it's running way better now
blknpurple
New Member
Thanks for the support guys, like I said, I'll continually update the progress of the car so others can learn too. So now I notice the car once it's going, it has less oomph than before, according to my butt dyno. I'm gonna try to mess with the timing via the dizzy, so if I rotate the dizzy towards the REAR of the car, it's advancing right? and rotating it towards the FRONT of the car is retarding? Also, how do I use that adjustable cam gear? Wait, Imma search for that first before getting flamed....
Chrisfrom1986
New Member
Dont mess with your timing unless you have a timing light. Your not doing any good without one. Your timing belt looks a loose but as long as its not moving around when the engine is running its fine. Get a timing light and fix your timing, hook up your vtec wiring and it should feel better. Your adjustable cam gear will not do anything for you. Just leave it set at 0.
blknpurple
New Member
Thanks to Civic Virtue, got the ECU on Weds, but I've been absolutely swamped, so no chance of installing it yet...Plan to do that tomorrow, I'm gonna do it right and solder and heatshrink everything. So I found a way to put that jumper harness to use by using the female ends from it. I used a pin so the removal was painless. I'm gonna cut the wires and solder them to the wires from the Vtec solenoid and sensor. Some pics:
Back of the plug:
Two wires I'm gonna be using:
Hey guys, also, would a y8 mani fit on the z6 head? Also, can I still clean my IACV the same way as the tutorials in RonJ's sig? Pretty much disassemble everything and clean everything up?
Back of the plug:
Two wires I'm gonna be using:
Hey guys, also, would a y8 mani fit on the z6 head? Also, can I still clean my IACV the same way as the tutorials in RonJ's sig? Pretty much disassemble everything and clean everything up?