Michael Richards (Kramer from Seinfield) Flips out

[Astheros]

ok...this is my last post....for real this time..

i dont think anyone has 'literally' argued that minorities deserve more than white people. i think we can all agree that all we ask for is 'equal treatment'.

actually let us not even make this about minorities...lets put it this way...there should be no crappy schools...there should be no outdated textbooks. there should be no underqualified teachers. there should be sports in every school, there should be equal SAT training in every school. there should be good education available for everyone. (of course this is relevant to public schools funded by govt) people should stop judging others based on the color of their skin. people shoul judge others by what they do, not what they dont do, because you dont know why they dont do something.

lets just give all our kids the same opportunity to become succesful and by the same i mean the same...the same opportunities and the same efforts required to take advantage of them.

i believe that if you have 2 people but it takes greater effort for one to achieve the same as the other but they still achieve the same then i respect both of them. however, if the person who has to make a harder effort does not achieve the same...i will still respect him because he had it harder so he simply did not make it....it does not make him lazy...he could have been just as strong as the other one...but since the other one had to make less effort that made the difference.

having said all of this...aside from poor rural white-mostly areas....all these bad things can most often be found in minority neighborhoods. now you can say that this is because minorities dont help themselves...but you can also say that its because the govt doesnt help these communities like they help others.

the private sector does not have a responsibiltiy to equally help anyone the same as another.
the gov't however has a responsibility to take equal care of every one of its citizens...black, white, latinos, asians, etc. we all pay taxes, we all work here, we all have families here, we all die in war. so why dont we all have the same schools, the same roads, the same buildings, the same jobs, the same parks, the same public transportation, etc. etc.

that's all i want. to clarify i do not blame white people...i think that is stupid...i just ask why is it that our minority communities are not given the same as other communities. i dont see any other reason for this disparity than our skin color or cultural background.

i just dont believe that the reason why so many of minorities are not succesful is because millions of them choose to be lazy and stupid (like some here have argued). and the reason white folks are plenty successful because they are hardworkers, and smart.

some of you have argued that skin color has not a single effect on the potential of someone....i agree completely...color does not influence any of who you are as a person. so someone answer me this question.

please do not focus on specific examples...look at it in the biiger picture and look at it as percentage of a population..(ex. the % of white people that are rich, the % of minorities that are rich divided of course by ethnich bg) percentage is equal measure since there are more whites than latinos for example.


question: why do you see so many white people enjoying good status in life and not so many minorities. why are the percentages so different?

i am not saying they are rich b/c they are white...but most of the rich are white.
to be clear....white does not equal rich...but rich equals white.....(for the most part of course)

WHY? i would like to hear some serious answers...look at this as an opportunity to give your best reason to convince someone to share your ideas.

thanks

 

[Melt]

Millions of white Europeans came to this country and flourished within a
generation! A generation! So what the f**k is wrong with these people?! (referring to black people)

just something to think about.

 

[Astheros]

just something to think about.

are you trying to say that: blacks have not flourished bc there is something wrong with them....because they are blacks perhaps? this would almost argue an intangible difference between europeans and blacks...the only intangible difference between humans is genetics. so having genetics differences and the fact that they have not flourished like europeans means there is something wrong. in this case wrong being inferior genetics.

but this is all just a maybe....imma let you explain what youre point was in posting that quote because the way i took it....its bad, really bad..but i dont know what you meant with any certainty.

so please elaborate

 

[oc_civic]

ok...this is my last post....for real this time..

last1  /læst, lɑst/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[last, lahst] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation

–adjective a superl. of late with later as compar. 1. occurring or coming after all others, as in time, order, or place: the last line on a page.
2. most recent; next before the present; latest: last week; last Friday.
3. being the only one remaining: my last dollar; the last outpost; a last chance.
4. final: in his last hours.

you keep saying that.. and then you post moments later..

i dont think anyone has 'literally' argued that minorities deserve more than white people. i think we can all agree that all we ask for is 'equal treatment'.

you could not be MORE wrong...

i believe in extra education opportunities for minorities..

actually let us not even make this about minorities...lets put it this way...there should be no crappy schools...there should be no outdated textbooks. there should be no underqualified teachers. there should be sports in every school, there should be equal SAT training in every school. there should be good education available for everyone. (of course this is relevant to public schools funded by govt)

and when i come home from a long day at work i should have puppies rainbows and gold on my front lawn your optimistic comments are nice.. but really dont have much to do with this conversation.. i mean who is NOT going to agree with that.. of course you want schools to be good.. captain obvious agrees with you

i people should stop judging others based on the color of their skin. people shoul judge others by what they do, not what they dont do, because you dont know why they dont do something.

i do.. most people i know do.. but the reality is you cant control people or make people decent people.. who cares what other people think of you.. granted my physical appearance is choice.. tattoos piercings.. but guess what.. people prejudge me constantly.. and to be honest.. i really dont care.. i live my life for me and my family.. your statement is nice.. but i mean its also obvious.. and its also the way that most decent people already think.. if you happen to live in an area over filled with chapters of the KKK let me be the first to tell you.. the rest of america is not like that.. we generally judge people on how they treat us regardless of race and religion..

lets just give all our kids the same opportunity to become succesful and by the same i mean the same...the same opportunities and the same efforts required to take advantage of them.

i agree with you.. unfortunately others in this thead do not.. they expect special treatment for being born not white.. which is obviously illogical and stupid..

i believe that if you have 2 people but it takes greater effort for one to achieve the same as the other but they still achieve the same then i respect both of them. however, if the person who has to make a harder effort does not achieve the same...i will still respect him because he had it harder so he simply did not make it....it does not make him lazy...he could have been just as strong as the other one...but since the other one had to make less effort that made the difference.

sure.. i again agree.. because your statement in context has NOTHING to do with race..

having said all of this...aside from poor rural white-mostly areas....all these bad things can most often be found in minority neighborhoods. now you can say that this is because minorities dont help themselves...but you can also say that its because the govt doesnt help these communities like they help others.

bullshit.. i live in a nice area.. and the government has ZERO to do with it..

the private sector does not have a responsibiltiy to equally help anyone the same as another.
the gov't however has a responsibility to take equal care of every one of its citizens...black, white, latinos, asians, etc. we all pay taxes, we all work here, we all have families here, we all die in war. so why dont we all have the same schools, the same roads, the same buildings, the same jobs, the same parks, the same public transportation, etc. etc.

taxes in nice areas are higher and therefore allow more money to be spent on schools.. you can not penalize people who generate a good income by taking the tax revenue they generate and shift it to areas NOT generating equal money.. its unfair.. and it again has NOTHING to do with ethnicity... the community i live in is fairly diverse..

that's all i want. to clarify i do not blame white people...i think that is stupid...i just ask why is it that our minority communities are not given the same as other communities. i dont see any other reason for this disparity than our skin color or cultural background.

i just explained it.. it is obviously a lack of correctly managed money.. get involved in government.. create a change.. if you see injustice do something about it.. there is no such thing as a minority community.. again you are segregating yoruself from the general population AGAIN just further promoting inequality.. you have a community.. that you live in.. if something is wrong you have a voice.. you also happen to be fairly well spoken, stop wasting yoru breath on someone who lives in new jersey.. NO WHERE in position to help you.. FIX IT.. YOU CAN..

i just dont believe that the reason why so many of minorities are not succesful is because millions of them choose to be lazy and stupid (like some here have argued). and the reason white folks are plenty successful because they are hardworkers, and smart.

thats not the reason at all.. we are a product of our enviorment.. if the people around us are determined and hard working.. it will aid in you being determined and hard working..

some of you have argued that skin color has not a single effect on the potential of someone....i agree completely...color does not influence any of who you are as a person. so someone answer me this question.

please do not focus on specific examples...look at it in the biiger picture and look at it as percentage of a population..(ex. the % of white people that are rich, the % of minorities that are rich divided of course by ethnich bg) percentage is equal measure since there are more whites than latinos for example.


question: why do you see so many white people enjoying good status in life and not so many minorities. why are the percentages so different?

i am not saying they are rich b/c they are white...but most of the rich are white.
to be clear....white does not equal rich...but rich equals white.....(for the most part of course)

WHY? i would like to hear some serious answers...look at this as an opportunity to give your best reason to convince someone to share your ideas.

thanks

your scope is very narrow... i literally know tons of "minorities" who are rich.. MOST people i know from India are VERY well off.. i mean that doesnt mean that all Indians are rich of course not.. but its just what i noticed.. i mean your question is very open.. i mean why are most rich people you know white? i have no idea thats a question that is impossible for me to answer..

but i must say i agree with a lot more in this post than previous posts..

 

[oc_civic]

are you trying to say that: blacks have not flourished bc there is something wrong with them....because they are blacks perhaps? this would almost argue an intangible difference between europeans and blacks...the only intangible difference between humans is genetics. so having genetics differences and the fact that they have not flourished like europeans means there is something wrong. in this case wrong being inferior genetics.

but this is all just a maybe....imma let you explain what youre point was in posting that quote because the way i took it....its bad, really bad..but i dont know what you meant with any certainty.

so please elaborate

as rude an as abrasive as it sounds.. its a valid question.. when people came here from europe.. it was s**t.. i mean disease.. cold.. harsh wilderness.. and it sucked... but they overcame those things and flourished.. there IS a certain amount of accountability.. by world standards even the worst slum is a paradise compared to the lives of some people i know.. i am very close friends with a women from vietnam.. the life she left behind is unbearable by american standards... and yet here she is... she left a country POOR unable to communicate.. and now she owns a home.. granted it is years later.. and granted she met americans who have helped her (not financially).... there was no school helping as she did not persue any education... she works a manual labor job.. but is happy and sufficient.. if this person... can travel to the other end of the world.. broke.. unable to communicate.. and still able to get somewhere.. im pretty confident that someone from the gheto can get somewhere if they simply apply themselves.. regardless of the percieved inequalities of american society...

 

[oldschooljdm]

I like this guy... probally the most real person whos posted other than slick rick

the bolded statement is just to show a stereotype. But i get what you mean

its much easier for people just to be real. Much better than nofx and eran trying to I.M. you and explain to you how you are a racist.

thank you

 

[Melt]

are you trying to say that: blacks have not flourished bc there is something wrong with them....because they are blacks perhaps? this would almost argue an intangible difference between europeans and blacks...the only intangible difference between humans is genetics. so having genetics differences and the fact that they have not flourished like europeans means there is something wrong. in this case wrong being inferior genetics.

but this is all just a maybe....imma let you explain what youre point was in posting that quote because the way i took it....its bad, really bad..but i dont know what you meant with any certainty.

so please elaborate

my point is that they simply have not flourished .... and it just seems strange that europeans came here peniless and made it happen within ONE generation ..... yet a large percentage of black people are still f**king up plenty of generations after slavery, segreatation, and other hardships have ended

remember i wasnt the one who originally said that, i just quoted it because i think its a good line.

 

[Going-West]

actually let us not even make this about minorities...lets put it this way...there should be no crappy schools...there should be no outdated textbooks. there should be no underqualified teachers. there should be sports in every school, there should be equal SAT training in every school. there should be good education available for everyone. (of course this is relevant to public schools funded by govt) people should stop judging others based on the color of their skin. people shoul judge others by what they do, not what they dont do, because you dont know why they dont do something.
i am not saying they are rich b/c they are white...but most of the rich are white.
to be clear....white does not equal rich...but rich equals white.....(for the most part of course)[/B]

WHY? i would like to hear some serious answers...look at this as an opportunity to give your best reason to convince someone to share your ideas.

thanks

I agree completley to the first part, and actually to the second part as well. Most people in the upper tax bracket are white people, because the world is NOT equal. I never said it was equal, and anyone who does is ignorant.

Our difference opinion is how we get equal. The way we get equal, like I've said multipe times, is to BE EQUAL. Not to continue putting white people above others in many ways (like in some cases we are now) and also not compensating by putting minorities above white people, i.e. my quote segregation brings segregation, not equality.

And the main other argument I've made, is against affirmative action. A more deserving white person should not be out of a job or position in a school because a less deserving minority is a minority...and this DOES happen and it's wrong. It would be equally wrong if a less deserving white person got the job over a minority is more qualified because the person hiring them is racist, which also DOES happen. It's the principle that's wrong, is has nothing to do with the race. The person more deserving for something should get it, period.

 

[Astheros]

last1  /læst, lɑst/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[last, lahst] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation

–adjective a superl. of late with later as compar. 1. occurring or coming after all others, as in time, order, or place: the last line on a page.
2. most recent; next before the present; latest: last week; last Friday.
3. being the only one remaining: my last dollar; the last outpost; a last chance.
4. final: in his last hours.

you keep saying that.. and then you post moments later..

haha..i know.

your scope is very narrow... i literally know tons of "minorities" who are rich.. MOST people i know from India are VERY well off.. i mean that doesnt mean that all Indians are rich of course not.. but its just what i noticed.. i mean your question is very open.. i mean why are most rich people you know white? i have no idea thats a question that is impossible for me to answer..

but i must say i agree with a lot more in this post than previous posts..

cmon OC i said dont use your personal life as an example...think about it nationwide...the big picture please.
yeah are rich minorities...not many of them. you might just happen to know many...i can tell you that i think i know 1 or 2.

a lot of people here seem to have answers as to why minorities are poor, uneducated, not succesful etc. if you have answers to these questions then you must surely have an answer for this one as well. (i mean you as in the general term not you specifically)

why does rich=white (not always of course) but for the most part. saying you have no answer is kinda a cop out...i just want answers from those of you who argue against me in my previous posts whatever it might be.

 

[oc_civic]

haha..i know.



cmon OC i said dont use your personal life as an example...think about it nationwide...the big picture please.
yeah are rich minorities...not many of them. you might just happen to know many...i can tell you that i think i know 1 or 2.

a lot of people here seem to have answers as to why minorities are poor, uneducated, not succesful etc. if you have answers to these questions then you must surely have an answer for this one as well. (i mean you as in the general term not you specifically)

why does rich=white (not always of course) but for the most part. saying you have no answer is kinda a cop out...i just want answers from those of you who argue against me in my previous posts whatever it might be.

i mean how can i answer that question..... its like saying why are most irish guys not brain surgeons.. maybe its a cop out? but there IS NO answer.. i mean why are minorities not successfull? if that is your question i dont have an answer because i dont agree.. i believe that anyone who wants to be rich bad enough will be... i believe that we live in a nation now that allows for anyone of any ethnicity to obtain wealth.. is it harder for people from slums to become rich.. sure.. but does that mean minorities.. NO.. because last time i checked low income areas are not minority exclusive... how many of you actually live in the slums.. or have at any time lived in a REAL low income area.. im just going to throw this out there.. but im starting to think that most of you actually come from pretty decent families.. and dont live in destitude.. and really area only talking about things that you think are happening....has anyone here ever been too poor to eat when hungry... i mean sorry to deviate so far from yoru question... but im just starting to wonder..

i guess since you ignored the part i posted with "blackhope" quote you are starting to see that we are all in different boats... maybe im on one side.. you are more in the middle and then there are others in totally different boats.. maybe my views of equality are overly optimistic.. but there are these other views that are was extreme in the other direction... racism in any form is silly.. thinking that you are afforded any differences based on the sin color you happen to have is a ridiculous view.. would you not agree?

sorry i can not directly answer your question...

but i stand by my statement.. if you see local government failing.. if you see local schools not being helped.. i ask you directly.. what are YOU doing to be part of the SOLUTION.. besides posting about it on the internet.. i DONT ask this to make you feel like s**t or to insult you.. but it is easy to complain.. it is much harder to generate change.. but complaining doesnt do d**k to actually solve the problem.. the other does...

 

[Mr. Jollypants]

its much easier for people just to be real. Much better than nofx and eran trying to I.M. you and explain to you how you are a racist.

 

[BlackHopeDC5]

As for the extra eduaction for minorities i worded that pooly..

Astheros says what i think And so does going west... I agree with them pretty much 100%

 

[oc_civic]

oc only thing im mad at is what you did earlier. That changed it for me. not the racism talk

i asked you what race is generally the ceo or top of big buisnesses in america. Who is usually at the top. I said will you at least agree that whites are at the top.. Just as a fact not as a "they hold me back" statement

You told me first that money that arabs own most buisness's.. Then you said in america money owns big buisnesses.. You wont even admit whites are at the top of almost all of america...

How is that?

you brought up a point via aim that i wanted to talk about
i removed your name so that it was not directly associated with you
you asked me to take it down...
i took it down..
now after i took it down you bring it up and want to talk about it...

but since you insist.. i am wrong.. the richest men in america..are for the msot part white men.. so you are right and i am wrong.. i fail to see how that matters?

 

[oc_civic]

As for the extra eduaction for minorities i worded that pooly..

Astheros says what i think And so does going west... I agree with them pretty much 100%

what you said was VERY clear...

 

[Astheros]

at least i am glad that this is turning into a passive educated thread without a ton of dumbasses arguing that minorities are lazy and stupid and should stop spending their money smoking crack or something.

 

[si-hatch86]

at least i am glad that this is turning into a passive educated thread without a ton of dumbasses arguing that minorities are lazy and stupid and should stop spending their money smoking crack or something.

this thread could have turned bad real quik. but so far its been civil.

 

[BlackHopeDC5]

what you said was VERY clear...

i cant talk to you man... i said i worded it poorly

you stay tryin to proove to me im a racist.. what are you looking for, me to say. O s**t im a racist?

 

[JiuJitsu_greg]

at least i am glad that this is turning into a passive educated thread without a ton of dumbasses arguing that minorities are lazy and stupid and should stop spending their money smoking crack or something.

Agreed, generalizations never work. It's just the same as your generalizzation that rich = white. Rich really doesn't = white. There are tons of rich minorities.

 

[oc_civic]

i cant talk to you man... i said i worded it poorly

you stay tryin to proove to me im a racist.. what are you looking for, me to say. O s**t im a racist?

im not looking for you to say anything man.. all i have to say is this.. you and i have forever gotten along great.. i have no ill feelings towards you..even now.. none at all.. BUT with that said.. a long time ago i asked you if you were racist.. you told me no... i believed you and went with it.. but with the statement you made... i believe that you are.. do i think you hate white people.. no of course not.. do i think less of you because of the statement you made? nope... i simply think it is a poor way to think.. and truthfully i think at the time you meant exactly what you said.. maybe you dont think that way now? i dont know.. the REASON i think this is because in the context of your other posts.. you PRIOR to saying that talk about how blacks and whites are not equal.. you then talk about school systems.. you THEN sum it up by saying quite clearly.. you DONT believe in afirmative action but you do however believe in and i quote extra education opportunities for minorities.. i mean CLEAR as DAY... if you didnt mean that.. what did you mean.. did you accidently use the word minority for the word poor.. please.. at least stand behind the statements you make.. OR admit they were wrong.. and you have changed your mind.. its ok to be wrong.. i admitidly did not realize that welathy america was mostly white.. hoenstly.. i didnt.. i thought it would be more diverse... and i ADMITTED to YOU that i was wrong.. for all to see.. its ok to be wrong and to learn something... i think that some thought needs to be given to this statistic and examine why.... but i still dont think that segregation is a helpfull solution... i further dont think having "extra" anything for anyone based on RACE is a helpfull solution... that single statement was by far one of the most surprising statement in this thread.. you even go on to say well i rethought this.. and if you are white and in a f**ked up area then you can go to college.. further illustrating that your initial comment WAS based solely on race.. and WAS intended to exclude white people..

 

[Akiahara96]

at least i am glad that this is turning into a passive educated thread without a ton of dumbasses arguing that minorities are lazy and stupid and should stop spending their money smoking crack or something.

you totally missed the point, because you're stuck on this race s**t. reread the post. it's about anyone in a poor situation, not specifically minorities.

OT - and now that i've watched the conqueror of shamballa (hate that ending!), i'm off to watch more anime... trinity blood, i think. enjoy the debate.